Is AI Taking Entry-Level Jobs?

0:00 Cold open: AI is coming for jobs

Milton: AI is coming, and it's going to replace jobs. So the question is: how do I deal with it? How do I take advantage of it? And if I do lose my job, what do I do?

John: I have a son graduating from USC. A lot of the entry-level business jobs are now gone, and internships are hard to come by.

Milton: I think: what else is new? It's always been the situation. New graduates have a hard time finding jobs. Nothing's new. God damn it, go for it! [laughs]

John: You say, "Hey, it's not going to take advantage of me now, because I already know all about you. I know what I can bring to the table, so you don't scare me."

0:45 Why we started this podcast

John: Hey Milton, thanks for making the time to sit and talk with me. We've been having a lot of these conversations one-on-one, and I think you and I decided we should start a podcast and let people benefit a little from our background and knowledge. One of the topics we're going to discuss today is what AI means for a lot of entry-level workers, potentially even young graduates coming out of college.

1:06 Who we are and why we're qualified to talk about this

Milton: Good. Given this is our first podcast, I would just say what we want to do. We feel both of us have a lot of experience. I have a PhD. I worked my way through college, and I built two companies and took them public. And you also struggled to build a startup company, and now you have a thriving service business. So I think we have a lot to offer.

And so I want to talk in plain language about hot topics that are of concern to people, such as AI: the impact of AI, how to deal with it, how to benefit from it, how to stay ahead of it, get ahead of it. In case AI replaces my job, what do I do?

And then we can talk about personal subjects, like healthcare, and living tips. I'm 85 years old and active. I'm acting like a 65-year-old, and I have a lot of health tips to pass along.

John: We both are fathers.

Milton: So we can talk about how to raise kids. Relationships. Right. And we both have good marriages. I celebrated my 60th anniversary. And then I have a whole lot of experience in business startups. I have probably advised no fewer than 20 companies, and almost all of them are successful, and invested in them. I'm currently still actively investing in high-tech companies, all the way from high-speed transceivers to cancer-curing medications and procedures. So I think we have a lot to share, and we will find interesting topics to give people a reason to watch our videos.

John: So we can actually say we have over a century of combined experience.

Milton: Well, I don't like to be conventional. [laughs]

John: So let's dive into our topic today. I'm coming at it from the perspective of people having a little bit of fear and concern. A lot of them feel like they're losing out. They're potentially losing their jobs to AI technologies that are replacing them. A lot of these are potentially secretarial types, clerks, maybe even entry-level software engineers. A lot of that's going away. Copywriters. So let's talk about it. Can you explain to me what your understanding of AI is? How long has it been around?

Milton: You're shooting five questions at me. I've got to deal with them one at a time, so maybe repeat it a little bit later.

3:56 Is AI actually coming for entry-level jobs?

Milton: I think the first question is: how do I view AI?

John: Absolutely.

Milton: There's no mistake: AI is coming, and it's going to replace jobs. So the question is, how do I deal with it? How do I take advantage of it? And if I do lose my job, what do I do?

To me, like everything, it gets overhyped. The impact of AI is not going to imminent. It's already beginning to impact the low-end jobs, so it is definitely coming. But on the other hand, there's time for you to react, to prepare, to take advantage of it and to transcend it.

For example, the computer came out probably in the '70s, and the laptop came out in the '80s, maybe. The comment at that time was that secretarial jobs were going to be replaced. And that's true, but it's not true.

5:01 Every technology gives you time to react

Milton: It's only now, with the advent of AI, that secretarial jobs are beginning to be replaced. So what I'm saying is that with every technology that comes along, there's time to react. On the other hand, it's real. Don't ignore it.

So the question is: if I'm a secretary and my job is going to be replaced, what do I do? How do I prevent myself from losing my job? Focus on the soft skills. We need to talk about that as a separate topic. But what I'm saying is there is time to react, to do things to prevent it. And if you do lose your job, there are plenty of options where you can have a very thriving income and benefit from AI.

In the meantime, you use AI. I think it's good to always give a personal, specific example.

6:09 How Milton uses AI in his own work

Milton: I spend a lot of time writing articles and coming up with video scripts for my bonsai heirloom business. I now use AI. Say I want to talk about the benefits of bonsai as a hobby. Before I even sit down and spend two days thinking about it, I go to AI, to Gemini: What are the benefits of having bonsai as a hobby? What can I learn from bonsai in managing my business? How do I use bonsai to teach my children a value system?

Boom. I get all these outlines that are very well organized. By definition it's well organized; it's all computerized. And then I personalize it. I say, nah, that's too general to act on. This is what you need to do; this is what it means. You see, now I can come up with a very enriched program, an article, a newsletter item, very thoughtfully analyzed but embellished with my input. So AI is helping me do my job.

John: So let me dig deeper into that. I want to look at it through the lens of that secretary. I think you mentioned in a previous discussion that a secretary potentially lost her job, or the manager of that secretary lost their job, and they're feeling really depressed. In your little anecdote there, you're saying, "Hey, I've got the ability to use Gemini to come up with a script." Tell me about the type of work that's coming out of AI that's not threatening to that secretary. What's the message to that secretary? You know what I mean?

Milton: Say that again, the last part.

John: So the type of work coming out of Gemini: what I'm seeing is you're prompting AI to say, "Give me some copy that I can use for my thing." But at the end of the day, you're still the chef creating the recipe. The AI is just making that recipe. So would it be fair to say to that secretary: hey, you still have the creative ability to create new projects, new things, and you now have the tool of AI to level up your game? You can be at a higher level now.

Milton: Yeah. So for example, again, keep it simple. Get back to the secretarial job.

8:24 The secretary example: adding the layer AI can't

Milton: So the boss says, "Write to Jack that the shipment is going to be delayed." And boom, AI gives you a really good draft. Then you say, "I know about this customer, Jack, and his situation." So when you retype it, you organize it differently, and then you say, "Jack, by the way, for your situation, we need to do this." Now you become an incredible secretary. Value added to the business. You've leveled up your game. So to me: add the personal touch. And you have to now be saying, if I want to keep my job, I'd better be alert and know my customers. Before, I didn't think of that. It's that kind of little, subtle change that's going to make you indispensable, make you much more valuable.

9:26 What the PC and word processing actually did to jobs

John: One of the patterns I think you and I talked about earlier was when the PC was first invented, and word processing was invented.

Milton: Yeah, it took a long time to replace secretaries.

John: Yeah, but immediately a lot of secretaries did lose some jobs, because the actual manager took on that duty. And then later on, a whole new industry of new work appeared. So maybe the idea is to say there may be a little bit of fluctuation in what the job market looks like now, but it'll settle into a new set of opportunities for you to take advantage of.

Milton: Yeah. I tell you, right now we live in a very confusing age. There's so much information thrown at you all the time, and there's so much chatter, so much clutter to confuse you. So, hey, I'm a writer. I need topics to cover for my newsletter, my newspaper article. AI? Oh, obviously. What the hell do I really know about AI? But I gather all the information that people repeat. So the information is building up in volume like that, but the information content is really only this much. It's really hard to sort it out.

10:49 Signal-to-noise: cutting through AI hype

Milton: It's a signal-to-noise ratio.

John: That's what we call it.

Milton: Yeah, in engineering we call it signal-to-noise ratio. I'm not putting down those writers. They're all right, but they're not that helpful. So you need to use your judgment: understand the basics of what AI is doing, and understand how that is going to impact me specifically. That's how you deal with it.

11:14 What Milton would do if he were 40 years younger

John: Right. So in terms of the secrets to your success, it seems like you've always believed in yourself, and you can transcend friction through hard work. Let's talk about that, because it seems like if you were 40 years younger, this wouldn't scare you at all, right?

Milton: Well, first of all, I'd want to learn everything about AI, so I can use AI to my benefit. We talked about how to increase my writing productivity and so forth. Then the second thing I know is that AI is routine, and it won't be able to act without building a robot. So I want to build job skills that are hands-on: make things, understand things.

And I also know a robot is a machine. It doesn't provide a personal touch.

John: Correct.

Milton: So I will establish a very big network and be very people-oriented, to really understand people, what makes people tick, and then be able to function very effectively. So if all else fails, I can be a salesman.

John: I like that message. You take your fear and you use your effort to fully understand the problem, so you can tackle it from different dimensions. So if you were 40 years younger, you would fully understand what AI is, its strengths and its weaknesses. You would take inventory of who you are, and then you would apply that. You'd say, "Hey, it's not going to take advantage of me now, because I already know all about you. I know what I can bring to the table, so you don't scare me."

Milton: Yeah. Let's broaden the question a little bit, to generalize it to career planning. When I came to America from a very meager background, my goal in life was to have a job. I had no idea. I wasn't sophisticated enough to establish a long-term goal, so my incremental goal, my near-term goal, was to have a secure job.

And what is a secure job? Well, an engineering job. I had no confidence I would have a good business. I don't have a rich father. But I can sure make things, design things. So instead of chemistry, my father said, "You're going into electrical engineering, because it's easier to find a job," even though my love, my passion, is chemistry.

John: Oh, wow. Okay.

Milton: It's okay. It's okay. So I studied engineering. And then I found a part-time job working in a repair shop for a research lab. During lunchtime, the graduate students getting their PhDs were playing cards, so I joined them playing cards. And pretty soon I said, why shouldn't I go to graduate school? And if I go to graduate school, why don't I apply to the best technical schools, Caltech and MIT? And so on and so forth.

So never stop making progress, but get good at what you're doing at any one time.

John: And that is the best way to tackle some of life's most difficult problems. Like right now, I can imagine you coming here with $500 in your pocket, and the number one fear is, "I'm going to run out of money. I'm going to have to live in the streets." And so you have to outwork that.

Milton: Yeah. Big deal. I'd go live in a cheaper place and eat cheaper food.

John: Right. There's a quote from Sylvester Stallone where he said he got used to eating cobweb sandwiches, so the movie studios couldn't take advantage of him. He had no monthly burn, so it wouldn't affect him.

Milton: Yeah. So one very important thing I also learned in life, in my career, is: go with your gut. I had a very good-earning job as a high-level member of the technical staff at an aerospace company. I sat back and said, where am I going with this job? So I took a risk and joined a startup company.

So another piece of advice is: go with your gut. Now, how do I relate that back to the AI discussion? Yes, AI is coming, but how do I excel in the job I'm doing? By understanding customer psychology, understanding how to better explain my product, et cetera. And then go with your gut. How can I morph and change so I don't worry about the oncoming AI? That's how I would address the AI problem. I don't have a concrete solution, but it's a fundamental way of thinking about it.

16:51 Take inventory: everyone has a superpower

John: Yeah. The only thing I would add on top of that, because I agree with everything you say, is you need to take inventory of who you are. I fundamentally believe everybody has a superpower. You just have to recognize what it is. Once you can tap that superpower, then you can be successful.

Milton: Yeah. At any point, do strategic planning. And strategic planning means doing an inventory, the so-called "now analysis": what are my strengths, what are my weaknesses, what do I need to acquire in addition to get there efficiently? And you go for it.

17:28 Advice for new grads: find your competitive advantage

John: Right. So let's switch the example away from the secretary, and now let's talk about new graduates. This is near and dear to my heart. I have a son graduating from USC with a degree in economics. A little bit about the economy: a lot of the entry-level business jobs are now gone, and internships are hard to come by. I actually have an idea of what you would say, because a lot of what you said is transferable to this very situation, but can you talk about that?

Milton: Well, I think: what else is new? It has always been the situation. New graduates have a hard time finding jobs. Nothing's new. [laughs] God damn it, go, go, go for it!

Well, let me be more serious. I think the first thing everyone, at any one time, has to ask is: what is my competitive advantage? What do I need to do to get that competitive advantage?

To me, a business major is really great. Economics is really great, because it gives you an overview. You can go into many places. But that doesn't buy you a cup of coffee. You have to think about specialization: become an expert in certain areas so that you become indispensable. That's your competitive advantage.

You've got to clearly identify what your long-term goal is. "I want to be king of the hill in e-commerce." "I want to be king of the hill, to sell a startup company that's very successful." You have to define your goal, and then identify the missing ingredients and the good ingredients you have to get there. And go for it. Take action. So I don't have an answer, but to me, the world is your oyster.

John: I still feel like your earlier answer applies: you identify the biggest problem, you learn everything about it, you take an inventory of who you are, and then you attack it with enthusiasm and energy. And that hasn't failed you. That's what you did to succeed.

Milton: Yeah. I mean, energy is what it takes, to be very positive, can-do. Because in life, everything is a self-fulfilling prophecy. If you start with a problem and say, "Ah, all these problems," you'll never go anywhere. You just say, "To hell with it, I'm going to overcome all these problems," and just go for it. Not being mindless, though. Being thoughtful.

John: Absolutely.

Milton: So let's see. I lost my train of thought, but anyway, keep going. [laughs]

20:17 "Take the job nobody wants": good advice, with a catch

John: I wanted to end with a quote that came up recently that's relevant. The COO of Chipotle was recently quoted giving advice to young students. He said, "Take the job that nobody else wants." And his example was a job that makes you report at 4:00 a.m.

Milton: The what?

John: Oh yeah, you have to show up at 4:00 in the morning. You focus on getting as much experience as possible to leapfrog your competition, the other students. And the last one is: take full ownership, good or bad, of all the results. That was his secret to success. What do you have to say about that?

Milton: Well, that's a pretty big topic. [laughs] I think for sure he's trying to fill jobs that are hard to fill.

John: Yeah, that's true. He might be self-interested.

Milton: No, more seriously, I think the advice he gave about the job that nobody wants to take, I would modify slightly by saying: it's a job that will lead to something. Going in at 4:00 in the morning to flip hamburgers isn't exactly going to get you anywhere.

John: Agreed.

Milton: So you have to be careful taking people's advice, and build on it based on reality.

On the other hand, back to the basic question: what would I advise your graduating son? There are several principles I go by. Take the job nobody else wants, because that gets you a job, but one along the way you want to go, not just any job. But more importantly, identify the competitive advantage you will have in anything you do. Identify a goal, say "that's what I want to become," and what competitive advantages you need to accumulate, or what weaknesses you need to overcome, to get there. And so that's a very specific target.

It's not like, "Ah, I wish I could start a business." Hey, get off your ass and figure out what is needed to be a successful business. Boy, that's a very long list. And then set an audacious goal, but establish scenarios to get through the milestones and achieve them, to essentially quality-control whether you're on the right track. And then modify, if necessary, your goal and your timeline, and keep working at it.

John: Kind of like a feedback loop. Based on what you've experienced, you can say, "Well, this doesn't tap into my expertise. This goal has now shifted."

Milton: Yeah. Don't take anything I say too seriously. And the reason is that nothing is quite right. For example, one of the things people advise young people is: be persistent. It's not wrong. It's great. But are you supposed to bang your head against the wall ad infinitum? No. So you have to take advice very wisely and put it into the context of what you want to do.

And so I think today the world is full of opportunity for people. Then, if you want to ask me, being a technical guy, I think economics is interesting, and it's easy. When we were in school, we were the hardworking guys in engineering...

John: Yes.

Milton: ...and the business guys were the party guys.

John: Yeah. [laughs]

24:00 Go deep and broad: what running a company actually requires

Milton: Right. So to me, business majors are a dime a dozen. Nothing. But the good ones are really, really good. The world is their oyster, because they know a lot of stuff.

And so what that means is, if you want to be in the software business, you want to know everything about software: the technology, the science of the software. You want to know about the customers, their applications, every detail. You want to know how companies are run, every detail. Like when I ran a company, I didn't know jack about...

John: And you were saying you were in charge of catalogs and marketing, right? A guy with a PhD in electrical engineering from Caltech running that is very odd.

Milton: No, but, no, no. I'm not good at making catalogs, right? And I'm not good at being a CFO. I'm not good at manufacturing. But I know enough to be dangerous in every field, everything within the company. I have enough competence to know what the real key issues are. So if I sit down with a high-flying CFO, I will put him in his place and tell him what he forgot to do, because I have insight into what his job should be, even though I cannot do his job.

John: And the lesson there is that you came in prepared. You came in wanting to know about that as part of your...

Milton: But not only that. I started from the very beginning, when I was a technical guy at Caltech. I subscribed to five magazines and read them every week. I know a lot of stuff, and then I apply it to the current thing at hand. So you need to be broad and you need to be deep. And to be able to manage people, you've got to build relationships. You've got to know what a corporate culture ought to be to run a good, successful company. It's a very holistic thing. So a business major is nothing. That's just here.

John: It's a good foundation.

Milton: It's a good foundation, but it gets you nowhere. And that's my message. You've got to specialize. You've got to go deep and broad.

John: It's also affecting entry-level software engineers, where a lot of that work is being replaced. But using your principles, I think you can overcome that as well.

26:27 Work as if you own the place

Milton: So back to your question. What I would recommend for Jack is to define his goals, and go work for a company, get no pay at all, whatever, to learn the ropes of that particular business, in the industry he's interested in. And work your ass off, I'm sorry, because you work as if it's your own company. And that's when you gain traction with management. They give you brownie points and teach you more. Find mentors. That's how you learn. They'll grow your set of responsibilities. Yeah, much more. Life is a self-fulfilling prophecy. If you act like you're the manager of the company, you may become the manager of the company. I mean, this is not BS. I told my people: work as if you own the company. Make decisions for what you think is right. I support you. No mistakes. And that's how you get firsthand learning. And with that, move on to the next gig. Move on to the next gig. He's on his way.

John: Yep. That sounds great. I agree with that. When I managed my teams, it was always about giving them ownership over things, and as they performed, you give them even more.

Milton: And that is so important, and most young people are missing it today. It drives me nuts working with young people, with a culture that's so different today than ours.

John: Yes.

28:01 Planning versus just doing: where the optimum is

Milton: Really, this is true experience. In our generation, the problem is we procrastinate. We do planning, planning, planning. It's never good enough. With young people, the problem is "just do it." It's great, you know, the Nike "just do it." But the problem is there's no thinking behind it. They don't even want to think about it. Just do it, try it. If it works, great; if not, do something else. They don't think anymore. They don't do scenario planning. They don't write business plans. They just go do it. And I'm saying the optimum is actually in between. So get all the tools to be in between.

John: I think that's great. That's very helpful, in that the procrastination of constantly iterating on scenarios in your head is something I have experienced firsthand, and I totally appreciate that.

Milton: Yeah. So it's to make quick decisions with a significant amount of thinking behind them. Not mindless decisions, but take action, and then modify. It's in between the two extremes. And then morph and change, and adjust as you go, quickly.

John: Hey Milton, this was a fantastic conversation. Thank you for making the time. I love diving into your experience, and I'm looking forward to our next conversation, when we're talking about wellness, parenting, you name it.

Milton: Yeah, I'm very excited about doing this podcast. I learned everything myself. I didn't have a father who taught me anything, or an uncle who taught me anything. I figured it out by having mentors, by reading books, by trial and error. And so I'd really hate to go away without passing on the good information. So trust me, I'm really doing this out of the kindness of my heart, honestly.

John: Right. Well, you're authentic about it. You authentically want to help people.

Milton: And so this is our first episode. We're a bunch of amateurs. We haven't done this before, not at all. And we will make continuous improvement.

30:30 Send us your questions

Milton: As I said, Rome wasn't built in a day. We'll make continuous improvement. And I really encourage you, the audience, to write in with your questions, comments and criticism, so we can improve. And we will not run out of subjects. If you ask us a question that we don't quite understand, we'll spend two weeks doing research and give you a damn thorough answer. I promise you.

So send in questions on any topic. We'll do our best to do a good job. You have two guys from the best school in the world [laughs] putting our minds together to address your questions. So let's go for it. Let's have one a week now, or two or three, but in due time, I think our videos will make a very big impact.

John: Thank you.

Milton: Thank you.